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Bladesnitz
Snitz Hosting Admin
USA
8 Posts |
 Posted - 25 March 2003 : 18:07:14
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quote:
Originally posted by GauravBhabu
Suddenly some more people have started to believe that They have the right to determine Who should Live and Who should Die.
I think those who should live are the innocent people of Iraq. Bush is attempted to ensure their lives.
Bush doesn't necessairly need Saddam DEAD, but sitting in a prison with no power is another option. I think when it comes down to the last minutes, Saddam will put a bullet through his own head. |
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Heynow
Junior Member
374 Posts |
Posted - 25 March 2003 : 18:08:44
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quote:
Originally posted by Doug G
The mandate to invade another soverign nation was never "to get rid of the bad guy". If that's the only remaining justification for this war, I guess this administration has followed the time-honored practice of lying to the public for the last few months.
If "removing bad guys" is going to become the mandate of the US, then 75 Billion is nowhere near enough. There have been and still are plenty of other bad guys around the world. Why this one and why now? That question still is not satisfactorily answered.
Try researching what happened in 1990 when they invaded Kuwait and many other atrocities this regime has caused. His threat to the US and his ties to terrorists. Imagine how the world would be if they got Hitler when some were warning the world about this man and his regime. Imagine if we got Bin Laden while in Afghanistan. |
Political Forums:::Stay n Chat
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Reinsnitz
Snitz Forums Admin
USA
3545 Posts |
Posted - 25 March 2003 : 18:14:32
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Um...
Did Turkey get UN authorization to move troops into Iraq?
Why Not?
We did. |
Reinsnitz (Mike) |
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Doug G
Support Moderator
USA
6493 Posts |
Posted - 25 March 2003 : 18:15:39
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quote:
Originally posted by reinsnitz
it had to be someone... caus we're going down the list... Sadam was chosen at the top of the list, had another person been in office, it would have possibly been someone else first, but Sadam would have been in the top two... guarenteed that there is a list, and it is going to be run down.
Wow, lets take over the world 
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Doug G
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Computer history and help at www.dougscode.com |
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Heynow
Junior Member
374 Posts |
Posted - 25 March 2003 : 18:17:18
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quote:
Originally posted by bozden
http://www.laweekly.com/ink/02/33/features-cooper.php
Very interesting interview indeed...
Imagine if they did...stop the aid, stop the genocide...oh yeah, that is quite a peaceful thought.
quote:
argued tempestuously that the U.S. should retreat back to its more Jeffersonian roots, that it should stop meddling in the affairs of other nations and the private affairs of its own citizens.
If Iraq invaded Turkey, would you feel the same way? If Saddam was your leader, would you feel the same? |
Political Forums:::Stay n Chat
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Edited by - Heynow on 25 March 2003 18:21:31 |
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Rasco
Advanced Member
Germany
3192 Posts |
Posted - 25 March 2003 : 18:36:54
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quote:
Originally posted by airilm
I remember people dancing in the streets, shooting guns in the air and burning american flags after 9/11 in some arab countries.
So apprarently the loss of innocent human lives means nothing to them.
Using religion as a weapon is wrong.
I remember this pictures as well, but it was proved, that they were a couple of years old and had nothing to do with 911
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Deleted
deleted
4116 Posts |
Posted - 25 March 2003 : 18:38:31
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I repeatedly phrased that I'm against Turkish involvement in Northern Iraq. I even e-mailed representatives in the council and phoned some of those that I know, have been in the organization of some protests against Turkey's existance, in addition to US existance.
I'm not sure if I can say this more straight (or you just fail to read everthing I write).
If an imperialist force comes into my country, I'd probably fight against it (probably without firing guns). Unfortunately, we cannot reject military obligations. But this is irrelevant.
I didn't know that US was invaded by Iraq.
I didn't know that there was an UN resolution for the last invation by US+UK.
What a dis-information !
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 Stop the WAR! |
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Heynow
Junior Member
374 Posts |
Posted - 25 March 2003 : 18:45:10
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quote:
Originally posted by Rasco
quote:
Originally posted by airilm
I remember people dancing in the streets, shooting guns in the air and burning american flags after 9/11 in some arab countries.
So apprarently the loss of innocent human lives means nothing to them.
Using religion as a weapon is wrong.
I remember this pictures as well, but it was proved, that they were a couple of years old and had nothing to do with 911
I seen the video of the celebrations in the streets of Palestine. |
Political Forums:::Stay n Chat
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Deleted
deleted
4116 Posts |
Posted - 25 March 2003 : 18:45:16
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quote:
Originally posted by Rasco
quote:
Originally posted by airilm
I remember people dancing in the streets, shooting guns in the air and burning american flags after 9/11 in some arab countries.
So apprarently the loss of innocent human lives means nothing to them.
Using religion as a weapon is wrong.
I remember this pictures as well, but it was proved, that they were a couple of years old and had nothing to do with 911
This was part of the dis-information they told to US citizens and UN...
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Stop the WAR! |
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Doug G
Support Moderator
USA
6493 Posts |
Posted - 25 March 2003 : 18:45:32
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quote:
Originally posted by bozden
http://www.laweekly.com/ink/02/33/features-cooper.php
Very interesting interview indeed...
Thanks for the link, bozden. Mr. Vidal didn't mention our "talk radio" media, which spews out hate & bigotry 24 hours a day. Within the last few years, one company has gone from owning 20 or so AM radio stations to now owning over 1400. Our congress sold out our media to special interests years ago, and now we are paying the price with continuous brainwashing directed by only a very few people. Rupert Murdoch bought his dual citizenship from Newt Gingrich (via a lucrative book deal while Newt was our speaker of the house), so he could circumvent the restrictions on foreign ownership of US media outlets.
George Orwell had things right, only about 20 years too early :). Doublespeak is alive and well " ... our war is in the name of peace". The perpetual staged war in far away places as imagined by Mr. Orwell is now in place, with no end planned. It's a war that's never been formally declared, but is being used to scare the s*** out of people so we can happily surrender our rights.
In the meantime, hidden behind this war noise, our current administration is destroying many of the fundamental protections for many other parts of our society. Oil drilling rigs are thumping through our National Parks. Pollution and smog regulations are being removed. We have prisoners that we've detained for over a year now, and have them incommunicado in a foreign country (a foreign country that's noted for political prisoners, I might add). A US citizen is blown up by a robot plane. Other US citizens are grabbed an put in jail without hearings, without lawyers, without all the protections we've been used to.
It's enough to make one think most of the significant events of the last few years were scripted by some hidden puppet masters with very different goals than what we all see publicly.
What kind of world will emerge from all this I don't know.
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Doug G
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Computer history and help at www.dougscode.com |
Edited by - Doug G on 25 March 2003 18:47:55 |
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Alfred
Senior Member
USA
1527 Posts |
Posted - 25 March 2003 : 18:46:41
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quote:
Originally posted by Doug G
quote:
Originally posted by reinsnitz
it had to be someone... caus we're going down the list... Sadam was chosen at the top of the list, had another person been in office, it would have possibly been someone else first, but Sadam would have been in the top two... guarenteed that there is a list, and it is going to be run down.
Wow, lets take over the world
This is the kind of thoughtless comment which draws criticism of the kind you call "flammatory".
Sure, you reacted to a militant sounding comment.
It probably was not meant as such, but rather as a reflection of the resolve to eradicate known evil.
But take a moment to look at what you really said in your oneliner.
"Take over the world"?
- 1. Do you want to take over Iraq (or Bosnia, or Somalia) or any other place we intervened in?
Most of us certainly don't.
- 2. To call the few outlaw regimes we are concerned with "the whole world" needs no further comment.
Why do you persistently ignore the purpose of our efforts, which you as an American should be solidly familiar with?
It is one thing for a youngster in a third world country to be brainwashed into the believe of American imperialist intentions, but it is quite another for someone with the good fortune of living in this country to be blind to the fact that despite our military might we have not territorial interests of expansion.
Or are you just doing the Berkelonian thing in vogue? |
Alfred
The Battle Group
CREDO
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Doug G
Support Moderator
USA
6493 Posts |
Posted - 25 March 2003 : 19:05:37
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quote:
This is the kind of thoughtless comment which draws criticism of the kind you call "flammatory
Not thoughtless at all. There is a group of people who seem to be committed to overthrowing every government in the world not in favor by the US. Rush Limbaugh talks about this with some regularity. George Bush talks about the changes in Iraq starting the dominoe effect on neighboring countries.
quote:
Why do you persistently ignore the purpose of our efforts, which you as an American should be solidly familiar with?
It is one thing for a youngster in a third world country to be brainwashed into the believe of American imperialist intentions, but it is quite another for someone with the good fortune of living in this country to be blind to the fact that despite our military might we have not territorial interests of expansion.
Or are you just doing the Berkelonian thing in vogue?
I don't ignore the purpose of "your" efforts. I put "your" in quotes because the current actions of our government are certainly not "my" efforts. The actions taken by our government in the last few months has already destroyed years and years of international relations. I don't like the Star Spangled Banner being booed in Canada, and I don't like the Canadian National Anthem being booed in the US. George Bush's "my way or the highway" attitude is unnecessarily driving wedges between the US and much of the rest of the world. The US Ambassador to Canada just stated that there will certainly be a "bump" in US-Canada relations because the Canadian government doesn't support the US war.
As far as the Berkeley thing, it has no relevance to the discussion at hand.
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Doug G
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Computer history and help at www.dougscode.com |
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Heynow
Junior Member
374 Posts |
Posted - 25 March 2003 : 19:08:30
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quote:
Originally posted by Doug G
quote:
Originally posted by bozden
http://www.laweekly.com/ink/02/33/features-cooper.php
Very interesting interview indeed...
Thanks for the link, bozden. Mr. Vidal didn't mention our "talk radio" media, which spews out hate & bigotry 24 hours a day. Within the last few years, one company has gone from owning 20 or so AM radio stations to now owning over 1400. Our congress sold out our media to special interests years ago, and now we are paying the price with continuous brainwashing directed by only a very few people. Rupert Murdoch bought his dual citizenship from Newt Gingrich (via a lucrative book deal while Newt was our speaker of the house), so he could circumvent the restrictions on foreign ownership of US media outlets.
George Orwell had things right, only about 20 years too early :). Doublespeak is alive and well " ... our war is in the name of peace". The perpetual staged war in far away places as imagined by Mr. Orwell is now in place, with no end planned. It's a war that's never been formally declared, but is being used to scare the s*** out of people so we can happily surrender our rights.
In the meantime, hidden behind this war noise, our current administration is destroying many of the fundamental protections for many other parts of our society. Oil drilling rigs are thumping through our National Parks. Pollution and smog regulations are being removed. We have prisoners that we've detained for over a year now, and have them incommunicado in a foreign country (a foreign country that's noted for political prisoners, I might add). A US citizen is blown up by a robot plane. Other US citizens are grabbed an put in jail without hearings, without lawyers, without all the protections we've been used to.
It's enough to make one think most of the significant events of the last few years were scripted by some hidden puppet masters with very different goals than what we all see publicly.
What kind of world will emerge from all this I don't know.
You may have some other valid issues, but I don't see what this has to do with the war. Unless your only claim is that we're all brainwashed from fear?
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Political Forums:::Stay n Chat
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Deleted
deleted
4116 Posts |
Posted - 25 March 2003 : 19:09:09
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quote:
It is one thing for a youngster in a third world country to be brainwashed into the believe of American imperialist intentions, but it is quite another for someone with the good fortune of living in this country to be blind to the fact that despite our military might we have not territorial interests of expansion.
Albert, this paragraph is a bit shocking for me, so excuse me because of asking from outside:
1) Do you think youngsters' ideas are not worth to hear?
2) Do you think people on this world are equal? Or, are US citizens are more equal than the others?
3) Do you believe that people from 3rd World are less valuable?
4) Did you read the interview I sent above?
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Stop the WAR! |
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Alfred
Senior Member
USA
1527 Posts |
Posted - 25 March 2003 : 20:15:58
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quote:
Originally posted by bozden
quote:
It is one thing for a youngster in a third world country to be brainwashed into the believe of American imperialist intentions, but it is quite another for someone with the good fortune of living in this country to be blind to the fact that despite our military might we have not territorial interests of expansion.
Albert, this paragraph is a bit shocking for me, so excuse me because of asking from outside:
1) Do you think youngsters' ideas are not worth to hear?
2) Do you think people on this world are equal? Or, are US citizens are more equal than the others?
3) Do you believe that people from 3rd World are less valuable?
4) Did you read the interview I sent above?
Bozden, I assume you are referring to me...but I resisted mutilating your name as well.
On your questions, I will give you the benefit of doubt, and put them down to difficulty of communication.
In that positive spirit I will try to explain something to you - in very basic terms.
Try to read the words and understand what they say, not what you think they say.
quote:
1) Do you think youngsters' ideas are not worth to hear?
The reference to the brainwashed youngster in a third world country has no correlation to your insinuation of discounting a young person's abitilty to think for himself.
As a matter of fact I will always listen before making that judgement, because in my many years I have run into plenty of idiots of all ages.
Which means that maturity is not necessarily a matter of age, but one of intellect.
The reference was simply made on the basis that a young mind can be influenced easier than an old one.
quote:
2) Do you think people on this world are equal? Or, are US citizens are more equal than the others?
This probably is part of the misunderstanding caused by a foreign language.
But I will try:
No. How long have you been around?
Surely you must have noticed that not all people are equal.
For whatever reasons, like everything else in nature, there are differences, and some people have less human values than others.
And some of those are an outright curse to mankind.
But at birth all human beings are equally deserving of the right to a decent life, wherever that may be.
The fact that I consider someone lucky to live in this country is not any reflection on that persons deserving, only on his good fortune.
There are many people in the world, living under miserable conditions (Iraqis under Saddam?), who may be much more deserving to live here than some of those who do.quote:
3) Do you believe that people from 3rd World are less valuable?
This kind of question is called "impertinence" - kind of like "putting words into my mouth".
I will overlook it again and excuse it with the language barrier.
Hopefully, after reading my response above you don't really need an answer to this question.
I will look at your link if I find time.
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Alfred
The Battle Group
CREDO
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Edited by - Alfred on 25 March 2003 20:17:52 |
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